crushed by elephant

[toexist]

Do we start killing the humans to extend the current level of the elephants habitat? Once the animal begins to expand so does its habitat that will extend far into populated areas! Right now not much we can do except maintain what habitat is left and the only way is through conservation, we have to maintain a balance between animal and humans, I prefer we maintain through conservation and one way is using hunting permits as we do in this country for various games. I would prefer conservation over frenzy killing and that would be the case if the habitat were allowed to expand into local villages.

I respect you Maverick as well as your opinion however I don't agree with ur argument here. I don't for a moment buy into the argument that we need to kill elephants. Africa is a gigantic country and elephants were around long before we were.

Certainly I don't buy into the argument that people trophy hunt because they care about the habitat. The people I've met whom trophy hunt couldn't possibly give a flying rats tail about the animals nor the people of Africa.

These are people with big money whom are attempting to express their masculinity...most of which whom have never been in a fight in their entire life.

 

[Maverick]

I respect you Maverick as well as your opinion however I don't agree with ur argument here. I don't for a moment buy into the argument that we need to kill elephants. Africa is a gigantic country and elephants were around long before we were.

Certainly I don't buy into the argument that people trophy hunt because they care about the habitat. The people I've met whom trophy hunt couldn't possibly give a flying rats tail about the animals nor the people of Africa.

These are people with big money whom are attempting to express their masculinity...most of which whom have never been in a fight in their entire life.

Africa is big no doubt but not all of Africa would be eco friendly, though Africa has many many countries within the African continent that don't give a rats about the ban on ivory much less the elephant itself.

Out of 54 countries there are 36 or 37 countries that have small and large population of elephants, some countries treasure the animal while others only want the money from the tusk.

Their are many very large areas in Africa that's not suitable for elephants thus they follow the water and food and that's generally in the area they currently are populating, if they are allowed to multiply in these areas the food would be depleted forcing them to migrate out of the conservation zone right into the hands of poachers, if the food is gone it's not just the elephant that suffers but other animals that rely on the same food source. Over population is very destructive to all animal that populate the area (ecological imbalance)

If my post appears all over the board it probably is, I'm using my phone to type this on an app... it sucks *sigh

 

[toexist]

Africa is big no doubt but not all of Africa would be eco friendly, though Africa has many many countries within the African continent that don't give a rats about the ban on ivory much less the elephant itself.

Out of 54 countries there are 36 or 37 countries that have small and large population of elephants, some countries treasure the animal while others only want the money from the tusk.

Their are many very large areas in Africa that's not suitable for elephants thus they follow the water and food and that's generally in the area they currently are populating, if they are allowed to multiply in these areas the food would be depleted forcing them to migrate out of the conservation zone right into the hands of poachers, if the food is gone it's not just the elephant that suffers but other animals that rely on the same food source. Over population is very destructive to all animal that populate the area (ecological imbalance)

If my post appears all over the board it probably is, I'm using my phone to type this on an app... it sucks *sigh

I just don't agree that trophy hunting elephants is the answer.

 

[DrHenley]

Look at the dates on that chart....

Kenya, where the greatest herds of elephants were at one time, banned elephant hunting in 1973. That is when that precipitous decline in the elephant population began - after the ban.

 

[toexist]

 

[Brent S]

I could never kill an animal that's as intelligent as an elephant, period. With that being said, I am in favor of population control. If they over populate their habitat and run out of food to eat, dying of starvation is way worse than being killed quickly by a hunters shot. They are smart enough to go further distances for food as well, which puts them in conflict with people. That never ends well for the animal either. It is a crappy situation for the animals, but is the best thing going in the world we are in.

 

[Maverick]

@toexit
We must distinguish the deference between trophy hunting and conservation, I think the two are being treated as one in this conversation. As I said early in this thread, I'm not a fan of trophy hunting but I do support conservation. I've seen trophy hunters waste meat (not all) and only taking the head quite similar to poachers but both are legally treated differently, conservation is maintaining and controlling the habitat through legally controlled hunting in this case.

 

[DrHenley]

Some people just can't handle reality...

Is that your version of sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting "LA LA LA LA LA" when you can't handle the truth???

 

[toexist]

Okay so we have established that pretty much all of you are in agreement with my way thinking as it relates to "trophy hunting".

In law schools across America they teach that one can always argue both sides of an argument regardless of how ridiculous...in order to justify action. Even murderers try to justify their actions by claiming self defense or claiming victims of abuse.

I in no way agree with or support trophy hunting of endangered species...particularly those as advanced as an elephant.

I also believe that killing elephants as an answer to conservation (an already substantially diminished population) is ridiculous.

This thread is about a trophy hunter not a conservationist. To argue that most people whom trophy hunt are conservationists...is even more ridiculous than trophy hunting itself.

This is my philosophy on that matter. Some can and will feel differently...that is perfectly alright.

 

[Maverick]

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Okay so we have established that pretty much all of you are in agreement with my way thinking as it relates to "trophy hunting".

In law schools across America they teach that one can always argue both sides of an argument regardless of how ridiculous...in order to justify action. Even murderers try to justify their actions by claiming self defense or claiming victims of abuse.

I in no way agree with or support trophy hunting of endangered species...particularly those as advanced as an elephant.

I also believe that killing elephants as an answer to conservation (an already substantially diminished population) is ridiculous.

This thread is about a trophy hunter not a conservationist. To argue that most people whom trophy hunt are conservationists...is even more ridiculous than trophy hunting itself.

This is my philosophy on that matter. Some can and will feel differently...that is perfectly alright.

Having pictures taken with ones kill doesn't really say much other than success, I have many pictures taken with my kills and even posted some on here, I have 11 mounted heads through the house and office with many mounted antlers and several salmon, it doesn't constitute anything other than successful kills. For a while here I had for my avy of a picture of me skinning a nice buck that was just shy of a Boone and Crockett record.

 

[toexist]

Having pictures taken with ones kill doesn't really say much other than success, I have many pictures taken with my kills and even posted some on here, I have 11 mounted heads through the house and office with many mounted antlers and several salmon, it doesn't constitute anything other than successful kills. For a while here I had for my avy of a picture of me skinning a nice buck that was just shy of a Boone and Crockett record.

We obviously have different perceptions on the subject matter and that isnt going to change. I'm sure if I lived your life in your shoes through your eyes...I would see many things differently. The opposite is true of course. This would apply to any two people on earth.

I never proclaimed to be a saint nor the moral police. I just don't agree with trophy hunting and likely never will. When I see people in the photos above...I see people completely disconnected from what they've done. I don't see conservationist who care about the endangered animals or the deep order of things.

All I see is complete disconnect and the lifeless body of an magnificent creature whom was killed unnecessarily...for sport.

 

[Maverick]

If the meat from the elephant feeds a village than not really unnecessary, game hunting and fishing in this country is considered a sport we have a limited number of moose in this state thus one can't just purchase a moose tag, moose hunting comes from a lottery and a certain numbers of tags are handed out once a year even though the state is limited in numbers. I think we can agree to disagree on the matter I think I'm going to walk away from the conversation given neither one of us aren't going to change our minds.

 

[Joe SA]

Just like the deer here, if not culled out by hunting and with no natural predators here anymore, they would starve to death if the population was left unchecked. Do you know if anyone eats the elephants meat?

Yes there are those that do, hope they proses it too, or feed it to captive predators, otherwise it's a huge waste.

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[Joe SA]

I love the psychology behind the justification for trophy hunting. These are the same people whom claim to believe in Jesus and the afterlife.

"Yeah see by allowing me to down this here creature you are allowing me to save the universe."

Moral posturing huh. Who is weak here?

Some rich guy (more than likely with no combat experience) flys across the world with a $5,000 rifle to trophy a display of his manliness.

Your target: An almost extinct highly sophisticated creature whom has existed long before man. One whom exhibits the ability of forming strong social bonds and arguably indicators of mourning their dead.

You enter this animals domain and a murder it from afar as if this is some how an accomplishment. Then in order to justify this you claim that you're helping the order of things. As if you care. Moral posturing huh?

I don't need to fly across the world to kill an elephant to feel more capable or accomplished as a man.

Then please come and show us how to fix the problem, since we are so backward in our mental capacity.

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[toexist]

If the meat from the elephant feeds a village than not really unnecessary, game hunting and fishing in this country is considered a sport we have a limited number of moose in this state thus one can't just purchase a moose tag, moose hunting comes from a lottery and a certain numbers of tags are handed out once a year even though the state is limited in numbers. I think we can agree to disagree on the matter I think I'm going to walk away from the conversation given neither one of us aren't going to change our minds.

Yes but does a wealthy trophy hunter really fly to the other side of earth to kill a member of an endangered species to feed villagers?

Let's be realistic here. People always find a way to justify their actions. I don't see the sport in killing an elephant.

 

[toexist]

Then please come and show us how to fix the problem, since we are so backward in our mental capacity.

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I'm not trying to fix any problem. I'm not the one trying to justify killing elephants for sport...you're. I simply don't contribute to it.

 

[Joe SA]

I'm not trying to fix any problem. I'm not the one trying to justify killing elephants for sport...you're. I simply don't contribute to it.

So should we just cull them and let the carcases rot in the sun?

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[toexist]

So should we just cull them and let the carcases rot in the sun?

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Poor attempt in reverse psychology.

 

[Joe SA]

Poor attempt in reverse psychology.

Coming from someone that does not actually have to deal with the problem, take it that you haven't grown up on a farm either?

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[toexist]

Coming from someone that does not actually have to deal with the problem, take it that you haven't grown up on a farm either?

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Don't try to compare farming or feeding the hungry to trophy hunting in order to justify your argument.

China and India have population issues. Are people to start trophy hunting humans too? Your argument is ridiculous. The elephant population is already drastically depleted.