Co BB guns, any good uses?
- Thread starter Sander
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I agree, get yourself a decent 22cal or larger. There is one advantage with a co2 gun as it is quiet. Not much good for more than small game though.
I have one. I got it to kill squirrels to keep them from going into my attic. I found out after the purchase that they are illegal to use where I live. .. so I haven’t used it
I 5hought Texas was pro guns....
They are, but this is a city thing. You have to be 600 feet out from the limits or so... I live in cookie cutter village.
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A BB gun illegal? Move.
@Sander If you can sell it, do so. If this is all you can get, then stock pile CO tubes but do not rely on it for defense. These are for very small game critters or very small pests (rodents = rats). They are one step above toy category, IMHO. The CO will run out and then you will just have a nice looking paper weight.
I'd trade them off for something more useful.
No kidding.
A BB gun can serve as a useful training tool.
Walmart has BB guns that resemble their "real gun" counterparts.
One can use a BB gun to practice trigger control, and/or to practice martial arts techniques that require disarming an armed assailant.
In the pest category, quietly shooting raccoons that get into the garbage teaches them (rather quickly, since they're actually rather intelligent) the negative, painful consequences of getting into the wrong garbage can...all without killing them.
People here in Florida use BB gun pistols while walking the dog to shoot bufo toads (Bufo marinus, a destructive, invasive frog). I don't do this as I find the practice disgusting, but they are a pest that sometimes kill dogs with their toxic skin secretions. They also out-compete certian native species and put some animals on the endangered list.
A BB gun can be used in the house to practice with different angles and shooting scenarios, and to practice gun safety techniques.
Walmart has BB guns that resemble their "real gun" counterparts.
One can use a BB gun to practice trigger control, and/or to practice martial arts techniques that require disarming an armed assailant.
In the pest category, quietly shooting raccoons that get into the garbage teaches them (rather quickly, since they're actually rather intelligent) the negative, painful consequences of getting into the wrong garbage can...all without killing them.
People here in Florida use BB gun pistols while walking the dog to shoot bufo toads (Bufo marinus, a destructive, invasive frog). I don't do this as I find the practice disgusting, but they are a pest that sometimes kill dogs with their toxic skin secretions. They also out-compete certian native species and put some animals on the endangered list.
A BB gun can be used in the house to practice with different angles and shooting scenarios, and to practice gun safety techniques.
I have a few air rifles, 2 are .22 caliber pellet rifles with scopes, the other is an older .177 BB gun. They will be good for quietly hunting small game and even good for the youngsters to hunt with. They are not exspensive and you can cheaply store many thousands of BBs and pellets for them.
Kevin makes a number of very good points.
Another example is if someone joins your group, and you're not sure about them yet. Give them a pellet gun. If they turn against you, it's not that powerful. But it gives them a sense of inclusion ("we'll get you a better gun at some point, but this is what we have...").
Another big factor is costs. How many hundreds of pellets do you get for just a few dollars (compared to 10cents/round for 22's). A good pellet gun will run you $100-200, but that's still cheap compared to a 10/22 Ruger.
I've seen some pellet guns that are every bit as powerful as a 22, they can fire 1200 fps (personal testing). That's with lighter loads, but even with the heaviest pellet I've measured 800 fps (nice because you don't get the sound barrier crack/noise). In fact that could be one reason for giving a new group member one, tell him it's the quietest weapon (and it is).
And what you can get with a pellet gun can be valuable. Not necessarily human food, not much meat on a gopher/squirrel/small bird. But if you are short of food for dogs or chickens or cats, these little critters will make a great mean for them. Yes, chickens are omnivores and happily eat meat when presented. What's cheaper, 1,000 pounds of dog food (and good luck with storage), or a pellet gun and $50 for a 5,000 pellets? And tell me about the volume it'll take!
Another example is if someone joins your group, and you're not sure about them yet. Give them a pellet gun. If they turn against you, it's not that powerful. But it gives them a sense of inclusion ("we'll get you a better gun at some point, but this is what we have...").
Another big factor is costs. How many hundreds of pellets do you get for just a few dollars (compared to 10cents/round for 22's). A good pellet gun will run you $100-200, but that's still cheap compared to a 10/22 Ruger.
I've seen some pellet guns that are every bit as powerful as a 22, they can fire 1200 fps (personal testing). That's with lighter loads, but even with the heaviest pellet I've measured 800 fps (nice because you don't get the sound barrier crack/noise). In fact that could be one reason for giving a new group member one, tell him it's the quietest weapon (and it is).
And what you can get with a pellet gun can be valuable. Not necessarily human food, not much meat on a gopher/squirrel/small bird. But if you are short of food for dogs or chickens or cats, these little critters will make a great mean for them. Yes, chickens are omnivores and happily eat meat when presented. What's cheaper, 1,000 pounds of dog food (and good luck with storage), or a pellet gun and $50 for a 5,000 pellets? And tell me about the volume it'll take!
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Sander, I was looking at the Estonian game laws out of curiosity, and I read that it is illegal to use air rifles for hunting in Estonia. Of course in a WROL (without rule of law) situation nobody will be checking...but for now, you cannot legally hunt with air rifles.
Here's the official document:
https://www.riigiteataja.ee/en/eli/ee/510072018003/consolide
Here's the official document:
https://www.riigiteataja.ee/en/eli/ee/510072018003/consolide
§ 24. Hunting means and methods
(4) It is prohibited to hunt:
(7)using crossbows, air rifles and laser sight and sighting devices for night shooting;
Food for thought.
In the US or places where air rifles are not limited in power the modern multi shot magazine fed plus 40 ft pound guns with take critters up to the size of a large dog, many are more than capable of doing great harm to humans up to 50 yards, in almost total silence. There are recently launched air guns now that are insanely well suited to prepping. Google Edgun West and look at the Leshiy 2.
No noise, No muzzle flash, No recoil, just the thwack of a 22, 25 or 30 pellet hitting the target. Recharged either by a simple (but hard work) Hand Pump, or from an air gun compressor, or like most instantly from a 5, 7 or 12 liter divers bottle.
No noise, No muzzle flash, No recoil, just the thwack of a 22, 25 or 30 pellet hitting the target. Recharged either by a simple (but hard work) Hand Pump, or from an air gun compressor, or like most instantly from a 5, 7 or 12 liter divers bottle.
Bows and arrows and crossbows are the way to go you can make your own arrows for Peter Pan
Me being Native American bows and cross those are second way of life for me you can make your own Arrow you can make your own bows actually out of green saplings
Not to forget very quiet it's very stealth sucks in heavy fire but if they don't know you're there do you still have the upper hand
And availability. At least locally, a lot of ammo is sold out- but pellets/BBs are still in stock. And a pellet/BB gun can be a great way to get a new shooter eased into firing without flinching.
I have one, use it on pests (starlings, rabbits, squirrels). Sometimes I'll bring it out on the trap line- if any part of your plans involves trapping for meat or fur, it can be a good way of dispatching animals without a lot of noise.
I recently purchased the Air Venturi Avenger. 22 caliber, 10 shot magazine, 300 Bar (4,300 psi) . Shooting a 15.89 grain pellet at 870 FPS. At 50 yard, my best 5 shot group was 5/8th inch. Cost of the air rifle $300. The big cost was the air compressor at about $400. Too darn old and tired to use a hand pump. Due to the ammo shortage and reloading components, this was my way to have some fun range time and help maintain my shooting skills. This will also make a great very small game meat provider.
If you hit your target as you should then it's an silent story. Otherwise it can be noisy. I dislike noisy victims....
But i love bows and crossbows, so i do own a few of them.
TMT get youself some pieces of pork with the skin still on, a watermelon and a couple of cans of spam. them measure your nice new gun at domestic and back yard ranges. Your gun is doing at least 22 ft pound, which means it could do serious harm if neccessary.
This article suggests HIGHER power Let's Tune The Air Venturi Avenger - Part One - Hard Air Magazine
TMT you should like this Air Venturi Avenger Full Power Tune - Part Two - Hard Air Magazine
Air Venturi Avenger Full Power Tune – Part Two
by Stephen ArcherJune 10, 2020
In the last post in this series, we looked at the performance of the .22 caliber Air Venturi Avenger in factory tune condition. This time, we’ll go for an Avenger full power tune. The results are very impressive for a $300 air rifle!
Last time we concluded that the Avenger was set by the factory to somewhere about the maximum regulator pressure setting of 2,900 PSI. But it seemed that the hammer was not striking the valve hard enough for that reg setting, hence the “peaky” shot curve.
So, the obvious solution was to increase the hammer spring tension. This is adjusted using a 2.5 mm Allen (hex) wrench engaged through an aperture in the rear of the pressure tube.
It was surprisingly hard to rotate the Allen key. However I turned it about two turns clockwise until it stopped. That was maximum hammer spring tension.
Next, I fired 10 shots using the same 14.66 Grain H&N Field Target Trophy pellets that we used to establish “out of the box” performance. Full hammer spring tension gave a significant increase in Muzzle Velocity – from 920 FPS in factory tune to 1,032 FPS.
That represented a healthy increase in Muzzle Energy from 27.52 Ft/Lbs to 34.68 Ft/Lbs. But 1,032 FPS was definitely likely to be too fast for accurate shooting.
To slow down the Avenger, I then ran 10-shot strings of successively-heavier pellets over the Chronograph. These were 21.14 Grain H&N Baracudas, 25.39 Grain JSB Jumbo Monsters and 32.40 Grain Eunjin heavies. That certainly did the trick, as the following table shows.
Looking at a graphical version of the same data makes it easy to see how the power (orange bars) peaks, then falls with heavier pellets. The red dots show the corresponding Muzzle Velocities.
Armed with this information, I decided that the 21.14 Grain H&N Baracudas would be my choice of pellet for the Avenger full power tune. That was because the Baracudas gave a healthy 884.72 FPS Muzzle Velocity for the 10-shot string. That’s right in the “sweet spot” of FPS for accuracy, as found in our previous mega-analysis of HAM test data.
Undoubtedly the Jumbo Monsters would also be a great choice. But for this exercise, I chose to forsake a little energy for the flatter shot curve of a slightly higher velocity.
So, with decision made for the Baracudas, I refilled the Avenger to its full 4,250 PSI fill pressure. Now to test the shot curve!
As you can see from the graph above, we now have a much flatter shot curve until fill pressure drops below that of the regulator setting at shot 59.
You can probably say that even more hammer spring tension would be required to completely flatten the curve. But we now have an Extreme Spread of 19.78 FPS, which is very creditable for 59 shots.
With an average Muzzle Velocity of 884.18 FPS across those 59 shots, that represents an average Muzzle Energy of 36.71 Ft/Lbs. That’s considerably above the figure of 34 Ft/Lbs shown on the Pyramyd Air website for the .22 caliber Avenger. It also represents excellent performance for a $300 PCP .22 caliber air rifle.
I think a “WOW” is in order
Air Venturi Avenger Full Power Tune – Part Two
by Stephen ArcherJune 10, 2020
In the last post in this series, we looked at the performance of the .22 caliber Air Venturi Avenger in factory tune condition. This time, we’ll go for an Avenger full power tune. The results are very impressive for a $300 air rifle!
Last time we concluded that the Avenger was set by the factory to somewhere about the maximum regulator pressure setting of 2,900 PSI. But it seemed that the hammer was not striking the valve hard enough for that reg setting, hence the “peaky” shot curve.
So, the obvious solution was to increase the hammer spring tension. This is adjusted using a 2.5 mm Allen (hex) wrench engaged through an aperture in the rear of the pressure tube.
It was surprisingly hard to rotate the Allen key. However I turned it about two turns clockwise until it stopped. That was maximum hammer spring tension.
Next, I fired 10 shots using the same 14.66 Grain H&N Field Target Trophy pellets that we used to establish “out of the box” performance. Full hammer spring tension gave a significant increase in Muzzle Velocity – from 920 FPS in factory tune to 1,032 FPS.
That represented a healthy increase in Muzzle Energy from 27.52 Ft/Lbs to 34.68 Ft/Lbs. But 1,032 FPS was definitely likely to be too fast for accurate shooting.
To slow down the Avenger, I then ran 10-shot strings of successively-heavier pellets over the Chronograph. These were 21.14 Grain H&N Baracudas, 25.39 Grain JSB Jumbo Monsters and 32.40 Grain Eunjin heavies. That certainly did the trick, as the following table shows.
| Tune Level | Pellet Type | Pellet Weight | Muzzle Velocity | Muzzle Energy |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Factory | H&N Field Target Trophy | 14.66 Grain | 920 FPS | 27.52 Ft/Lbs |
| Full Power | H&N Field Target Trophy | 14.66 Grain | 1,032 FPS | 34.68 Ft/Lbs |
| Full Power | H&N Baracuda | 21.14 Grain | 884.72 FPS | 36.75 Ft/Lbs |
| Full Power | JSB Jumbo Monster | 25.39 Grain | 818.71 FPS | 37.80 Ft/Lbs |
| Full Power | Eunjin Pointed | 32.4 Grain | 712.00 FPS | 36.48 Ft/Lbs |
Armed with this information, I decided that the 21.14 Grain H&N Baracudas would be my choice of pellet for the Avenger full power tune. That was because the Baracudas gave a healthy 884.72 FPS Muzzle Velocity for the 10-shot string. That’s right in the “sweet spot” of FPS for accuracy, as found in our previous mega-analysis of HAM test data.
Undoubtedly the Jumbo Monsters would also be a great choice. But for this exercise, I chose to forsake a little energy for the flatter shot curve of a slightly higher velocity.
So, with decision made for the Baracudas, I refilled the Avenger to its full 4,250 PSI fill pressure. Now to test the shot curve!
As you can see from the graph above, we now have a much flatter shot curve until fill pressure drops below that of the regulator setting at shot 59.
You can probably say that even more hammer spring tension would be required to completely flatten the curve. But we now have an Extreme Spread of 19.78 FPS, which is very creditable for 59 shots.
With an average Muzzle Velocity of 884.18 FPS across those 59 shots, that represents an average Muzzle Energy of 36.71 Ft/Lbs. That’s considerably above the figure of 34 Ft/Lbs shown on the Pyramyd Air website for the .22 caliber Avenger. It also represents excellent performance for a $300 PCP .22 caliber air rifle.
I think a “WOW” is in order
Very good info, Billmasen, thanks for the post . My chronograph arrives tomorrow and serious testing begins next Thursday. I have three different pellet weights, so I should be able to find the optimal power AND accuracy setting. The only thing I need to work out, is where I can do the air reservoir refilling. Safety rules at the range require all weapons be uncased at the shooting bench and there are NO outlets there. I do have access to outlets near the firing line but that would requiring the rifle barrel to be pointed up and the rifle placed in a rack. I will see if I can use the backroom of the club house. Being a Range Safety Officer there, I should have a few privilege's. LOL
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