Non permissive living environment tactics

[Squirtgunsquirter]

So, I sold a couple belts through my friend in the mil, and got to talk to one of the customers, and had a great conversation about living in the city pre and post SHTF.

The customer is in a counter terrorism unit (I didn't ask what unit, no need to) who travels overseas on a regular basis.

Anyway, with his permission, I took notes during the conversation, and I will be making some posts as I research and have more conversations with him.

He said it is incredibly complex to do well, and from the notes I have, it covers a lot of material.

So I will have to structure this, the notes where taken during a normal, fast conversation, so forgive me if some things seem a bit out of order I will do my best.

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

"Lone operator tactics"

So the guy I spoke to actually has training for this. And it is complicated, and involves a lot of skills.

While he would be worried about being alone, for whatever reason, in a hostile foreign country, we both agreed the same tactics would apply in the US in a grid down, SHTF situation. The customer is also a prepper by the way, and considers anyone who is not at least a LITTLE bit prepped, somewhat crazy.

Some of the things he mentioned aren't things I normally consider, some are pretty obvious, some I just don't have the means to carry out (force on force training with simunition) but I will cover them anyway.

• TRENDS: This is simply knowing your city, or area. Is crime prevalent in a certain area? Does their seem to be more crime in your area? (this is a definite yes for me, things have changed in the last 4 years). He advised just checking out a local news station, online, and keeping a notebook. Nothing ridiculous, just note down the locations of shootings, burglaries, car theft, anything reported. Just once a week or so. After a while you can build up a map, if you want, or even find one online depending on where you live, and build up a picture of your area, and track the trends happening. In his case, he would be tracking knows members of a certain religious group being seen in an unusual area, or frequent incidents with unfriendlies along a certain road or some such. For me, it will just be crime, but it has to be part of the overall picture.

Micro and Macro: Trends close to home, trends nationwide or even worldwide, depending on how big a net you want to cast. Point being, just be aware of what's happening.

• HOW YOU LOOK AT OTHERS: Do you notice people? If you are a city person, does everyone just fade into the everyday crowd? Not long ago, at an outdoor concert, I immediately noticed a middle aged white male, grey hair cut short, clean shaven, black leather "bomber" style jacket, blue jeans and black work shoes, and I noticed him because he was pissed. I have no idea what about, but he was visibly looking for someone, and clearly upset and angry. He walked directly through my wife's field of view, looking like he was on his way to a murder, and she didn't even notice. I think there is more to this than just situational awareness, I think this goes to personal prejudice, and even trust. I will talk to the guy again about this particular subject.

• HOW YOU LOOK TO OTHERS: This one is simply what image you convey. Do you look wealthy? Do you look weak, like easy prey? Do you look afraid? Do you look like an axe murderer? Just to be aware of what you look like, what people might be thinking when they look at you. The guy I am talking to about this stuff is a big believer in the "gray man" way of thinking. You don't want to stand out, wherever you are. To me, this would be extremely difficult, depending on if you HAD TO move somewhere, and had to take your stuff on foot. It might mean carrying very little? Anyway, something I can talk about more later.

I'm going to break this up into separate posts.

Up next, communities, groups, and individuals.

 

[Danil54grl]

as soon as I started reading the "grey man" was my first thought. Dont stand out and always be aware of your surroundings

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

• COMMUNITIES: There are many different "communities" here in Madison, Wisconsin. Webster's defines community as a group of people with a common characteristic or interest living together within a larger society, or scattered throughout it. Some of the communities to identify here would be the college community, the law enforcement community ( I would include fire fighters and paramedics in this community), religious communities, professional organizations, I would even include organizations like the Masons. There is no Prepper community in Madison to speak of. The only community I personally interact with here would be the Hmong community, and only because we garden together, and a family lives downstairs in the condo building. Since this is all about information, almost a civilian intelligence gathering exercise, I am definitely failing here. I don't know any police in town to speak to. I don't really interact on a regular basis with any communities, I am not going to be getting any "word on the street".

How would I solve this? I could expand my horizons a bit and join a community like the Masons. I could work at being in places where I could interact with the police on a non professional basis. I can't really join a professional organization, maybe a local chapter of the NRA? There IS a local prepper meetup group, with 400 members, but I check the page frequently, and they have very low (5 or 6) attendance at meetups, and all of the meetups are WAY overpriced. $75 dollars for a 2 or 3 hour lockpicking class, and the instructor is almost always the same guy, the "owner" of the meetup group. I will just say I have been leery of attending for several reasons, the main one being it seems more financially motivated than about forming a prepper community. I could be wrong. Maybe I should attend a meeting or two, and get a feel for it.

The good part here, is that I have NO "standing" in any of these communities, good or bad. If I choose to pursue making contacts, it would be from a fresh start.

• GROUPS: I consider a group to be a community, but on a much smaller scale, and without a religious, professional, or ethnic component. A group of friends, small groups with a larger community. If I were to try to penetrate any of these communities, I would start with individuals, then groups, then achieve standing and reputation within a larger community.

• IDIVIDUALS: This is where it all begins. I think the point of discussing communities, groups, and individuals, from a prepping perspective, is to find ways to have a mutually beneficial interaction. We aren't talking about making lifelong friends here, although that could happen. We just want a wide network of people we talk to on a semi regular basis. In a SHTF event, we would know some members of these communities and groups, they don't have to know we are preppers, they could just be people we could communicate with, and learn from. I have spoken before of the Hmong community here in Madison, and how we garden together and I buy from their farm stands. In an emergency, they could be a possible source of barter. It is challenging, with my background, to befriend police officers. It's a cultural thing. I just don't talk to the police, because they are ALWAYS at some level, a police officer first. I am friends with a Federal officer, and family with a narcotics officer, but that is it. "Getting to know" a police officer would honestly be very difficult for me, and I am not so smooth that he or she wouldn't quickly realize I am just looking to pick their brains about shit. Maybe best to leave that community alone.

Anyway, the gist of all this is to just to identify Communities, Groups and Individuals of benefit to our preparedness, and spread as wide an information network as possible. I am way behind the curve on this. I work, and that's about it. I don't strike up conversations at the gym. I'm friendly, but not outgoing. Not sure how I would change that to accomplish the seemingly herculean task of "putting myself out there" to even start this.

 

[grayghost668]

the gray man,,,I fit that bill even at work,,,

I go in do my thing and leave I don't want to be buddies with the rest of the guys,,I keep to myself,,,as for the area I live in we all know each other and I know who not to trust, at my house,no one gets past the front door,the last person inside my home was the insurance agent when I bought this place in 2004,,,,yeah I am a little anti-social,,,,,,,when out to town jeans and a t-shirt and a hoodie if it is cold,and the hood is up most of the time,,,I make it quick and back to my hole I go

I do my socializing here on the web

 

[drt4lfe]

I found that you can only trust yourself. The less so called friends surrounding you the better, If you are lucky you will have one, maybe two true friends in your lifetime, A friend who would come running in a minute if you needed them for whatever reason. Being aware and not standing out has always been smart, regardless of where you live. I always scan right and left when entering or leaving a building. I go the empty checkout line or wait till one is empty. I avoid all drama in public, if someone is arguing or making some kind of a ruckus I go in the other direction. I won't allow myself to get drawn into someone's petty stupid drama, but if you come at me with it ? there will be a response. I keep at least two guns in my truck, a handgun that is on me or within reach and a rifle, ammo and small pack in toolbox, If I ever need to get the rifle someone may have a bad day. I avoid all family drama to the point I rarely associate with any of them, that may sound bad and I guess in some ways it is, but I won't be involved in the drama. I would rather be alone. I often talk to people at Gun Shop's and have several acquaintances I see at the Rifle Range who I shoot the gun talk with...reloading, scopes and such, but none of them are people I associate with other than that. If something bad was going on I feel confident myself and those acquaintances would be agreeable and could work together. Who do you trust in these times ? I may get to find out....

 

[Maverick]

Cities and large towns (small cities) I avoid and only go when absolutely necessary. The gray man approach is what I do whenever off the property. Come a SHTF/TEOTWAWKI I wont be entering any cities of any size, as far as I'm concern it's a death trap and that includes the blacktop (roads)

 

[grayghost668]

Cities and large towns (small cities) I avoid and only go when absolutely necessary. The gray man approach is what I do whenever off the property. Come a SHTF/TEOTWAWKI I wont be entering any cities of any size, as far as I'm concern it's a death trap and that includes the blacktop (roads)

I live in a small town,depending on what type of SHTF it is I plan on at least 1 trip in to see what is left, late night when no one should be out and about

 

[Maverick]

The small town where my wife has a house it has about 100 people their all older than I am, I'll go their but not for a long period of time, for a couple of hours picking stuff up from her house that's about it.

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

Trying to setup a meet up with some other preppers in the South Wisconsin area, we will see how it goes, or if it happens.

So the next part on my notes was (and ties in nicely with what everyone has been saying above):

AVOIDANCE

Once you have identified trends in your area, and you are familiar with the communities and groups and individuals, you can avoid trouble post SHTF.

Bad area of town? Obviously stay away.

Also, just avoid trouble. Walk away from confrontations if you can. This is difficult for me, I have probably too much foolish pride, and I have a temper. When I get into righteous anger mode, my past is a pretty clear indicator that I am going to WANT to fight. So I will have to really concentrate on getting away.

Part of this is a certain type of training that I have been looking for, without much success. The whole point of this thread is, for me, (WOOHOO just got messaged for some CQB training from a CQB instructor SOOOOO STOKED LOL!!!) anyway back to the post, the point of this exercise for me is to protect my people. I want to disengage, get them and me away from threats. It is HARD to find legitimate instruction in a fighting retreat.

So, avoid confrontation. Avoid (because you have done your homework) problem areas. Avoid "advertising" yourself, in life or on the street in an event.

Avoid avoid avoid.

 

[jontte]

it used to be easier here,until the the "town authorities" started to house "problem" individuals here too,their great plan is/was that they will be "rehabilitated" among good people..sure a drug user/seller is turning into a saint ,so now you have to inspect your basement on regular basis.
so there's one flat,which in shtf will be trouble.
so I don't feel any urge to interact too much here among my neighbors,I greet them,have some small talk,but that's all,as I really don't get that gut feeling of trust,only person here living close me,who I trust is my brother (0,8 miles away),practically neighbors.

what training do I have into "operating" in hostile enviroments? well,the reserve unit I am in, is trained in urban combat,including all the shyt it comes with.
still,I'm just a rookie in that,but know far more about it,than the others living here,still having a buddie or two would be nice.

so I try to blend in the surrounding,though there is something in me,that makes people remember me,still don't know what,prolly my sunny and handsome looks

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

"what training do I have into "operating" in hostile enviroments? well,the reserve unit I am in, is trained in urban combat,including all the shyt it comes with.
still,I'm just a rookie in that,but know far more about it,than the others living here,still having a buddie or two would be nice."

But the thing is, Jontte, what is that training all about? Team movement? Comms? Leapfrogging? It's all about offense, not necessarily defense, and the defense is what I want.

Know the areas to avoid, and avoid them. Know the groups of people to avoid, and avoid them. If there is a situation, get away, fight my way out if I must.

Being in any kind of unit is a huge advantage, in any situation. But, like you, I have no unit. It's just me. So I want some tactics to get me away from problems. Situational awareness, blending in, and then a hasty retreat.

The instructor I am talking to says that for I am talking about, there aren't any "advanced tactics", just perfect execution of fundamentals, the first time.

When I get to do this, I will be sure to post about the course, and the results. This actually came about because of this thread, I talked to someone, and they talked to someone who talked to someone, and now I get a free CQB course, I just have to pay for the flight.

Networking.

Now I have to see how this potential prepper group meet up goes, maybe I can meet some folks around here who are dependable, or at least willing to train and practice skills with. Which would be nice, socializing in person with others of like mind and similar interests.

 

[jontte]

that all important situational awareness!!
belive it was Silent Earth,who mentioned it first time,now it's kinda natural to me,to watch,listen and plan a few steps ahead.
kinda follow the rule;KISS

hope you enjoy that CQB,as we have this defence org. here who provides courses for the reservists,I'm planning to take one or two in CQB and field medicine,
sure I'll have to pay a fee for those,but the training is invaluable and will help me in the future.

and we got some very important tips in defence too in that week I spent with my buddies,oh it would be so nice to have a group,but it is what it is,just have to adapt.

 

[Gazrok]

late night when no one should be out and about

I always thought early, early morning would be best (like from 2am - 4am). To me, this just seems the best time to not only miss those who will want to sleep, but even missing the night owls who will stay up.

 

[bigpaul]

that all important situational awareness!!
belive it was Silent Earth,who mentioned it first time,now it's kinda natural to me,to watch,listen and plan a few steps ahead.
kinda follow the rule;KISS

also known as "watching your back", believe me if you've lived in a city as long as I did, it comes as second nature.
I still don't like heavy footsteps coming up behind me, and in public I sit with my back to a wall.
its not paranoia, its being careful.

 

[Gazrok]

I simply don't allow folks to walk behind me within 10 feet. I'll simply stop, turn a little, and pretend to do something else until they pass me and I can walk again. It's a bit tricky at theme parks sometimes, but I try to always be aware.

 

[Squirtgunsquirter]

My wife has been with me for a few crazy Ivan's. Driving along, just pull off and hit the hazards. "Honey, what's up?" "That car followed me for one too many turns." It's just, I don't know how to explain it, I don't like having the same car behind me too long, unless its on an interstate or something. If I get off on a cloverleaf, and they do too? I notice, I cant help it. I'm sure it's never someone following me, I know that. I just can't help, its like an itch I have to scratch.

I have a pretty funny story about someone watching my house (years ago, yes I had every reason to think someone was watching my house, I wasn't being a very good citizen) I will have to tell it sometime.

 

[bigpaul]

I simply don't allow folks to walk behind me within 10 feet. I'll simply stop, turn a little, and pretend to do something else until they pass me and I can walk again. It's a bit tricky at theme parks sometimes, but I try to always be aware.

which most people aren't, too busy with their mobiles to be aware of what is going on around them, which is why they become victims.