Disasters and crime

3 hurricanes, 3 big cities, 3 different results.

Harvey first. Houston. I've mentioned this before. First two people I heard of breaking into someone's house were shot and killed. A friend of mine that lives there heard a truck pull up to the back of her house. She went to her back door with her handgun & large dog. 3 guys quickly got back in their truck & drove off VERY quickly (nobody shot). I haven't heard about hardly any other crimes, at least no more than 'normal'.

Irma across Florida. 100's of thugs have been arrested. Plenty of crime still going on, above average, but not out of control. But then FL is a reasonable area with 'mostly' honest people.

Then there is Hurricane Maria & Puerto Rico. See http://www.miamiherald.com/news/weather/hurricane/article179863816.html . PR is a well known corrupt island, crime normally is rampant. The article makes many really good points. For example without power there is no alarm systems. No lights to deter crime. Few phones to call police & can they even show up. 34 murders since Maria (known cases), they had 670 total last year.

Stressful times bring out what people really are.

I've just been having an online conversation elsewhere, I stated that come SHTF we will see the baser side of human nature( based on my life time experience of other people, people watching etc.etc), this other person wont have it, they think everyone is good and noble and wont commit any crime or hurt others during this time!!!I mean get a grip!!!

Two sides to that coin bigpaul. I think both the best side and the worst side will come out.

yes and the better side will suffer because of the worst side.
I trust no one, then I wont be surprised when they let me down .

If you live in a place that does not have adequate natural resources to support the population, I don't have much hope for the better side. Dog eat dog is about all I can see possible. cough...cough...Chicago...cough...cough

But if there are adequate resources, I think it's possible. That's why my BOL is in a place where the population density is very low (1/10th that of North Devon, and it's a long long way from a major population center), the natural resources are abundant, the soil is fertile, and the growing season is long. I think (hope?) I'll be able to convince the locals to cooperate and build a stable post-SHTF society.

good luck with that, the population here will be also 1/10th of what it used to be in a post SHTF situation.

DrHenley said:

If you live in a place that does not have adequate natural resources to support the population, I don't have much hope for the better side. Dog eat dog is about all I can see possible. cough...cough...Chicago...cough...cough

But if there are adequate resources, I think it's possible. That's why my BOL is in a place where the population density is very low (1/10th that of North Devon, and it's a long long way from a major population center), the natural resources are abundant, the soil is fertile, and the growing season is long. I think (hope?) I'll be able to convince the locals to cooperate and build a stable post-SHTF society.

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Go f##k yourself religious doctor.

TexasFreedom said:

3 hurricanes, 3 big cities, 3 different results.

Harvey first. Houston. I've mentioned this before. First two people I heard of breaking into someone's house were shot and killed. A friend of mine that lives there heard a truck pull up to the back of her house. She went to her back door with her handgun & large dog. 3 guys quickly got back in their truck & drove off VERY quickly (nobody shot). I haven't heard about hardly any other crimes, at least no more than 'normal'.

Irma across Florida. 100's of thugs have been arrested. Plenty of crime still going on, above average, but not out of control. But then FL is a reasonable area with 'mostly' honest people.

Then there is Hurricane Maria & Puerto Rico. See http://www.miamiherald.com/news/weather/hurricane/article179863816.html . PR is a well known corrupt island, crime normally is rampant. The article makes many really good points. For example without power there is no alarm systems. No lights to deter crime. Few phones to call police & can they even show up. 34 murders since Maria (known cases), they had 670 total last year.

Stressful times bring out what people really are.

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Whats the matter TexicoFreedom...not a big enough audience for your religious cult so you resort to stirring the pot with more of this "we're better than them" nonsense. Same story different page every time.

You are the epitome of everything wrong with religion. I'm sure if an all knowing supreme creator did exist...he would take your same divisive approach to promoting his way if life.

I'm sure he is looking down and thinking...we need more TexicoFreedoms in this world.

DrHenley said:

cough...cough...Chicago...cough...cough

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Doc, your posts always give me a chuckle. But sadly just like that city, the cockroaches have come out. I thought that guy disappeared & got kicked off the forums? I can't see what he posts (blocking is a WONDERFUL thing).

TexasFreedom said:

Doc, your posts always give me a chuckle. But sadly just like that city, the cockroaches have come out. I thought that guy disappeared & got kicked off the forums? I can't see what he posts (blocking is a WONDERFUL thing).

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You couldn't afford to live in my city you peasant. Your just lonely abandoned old man with junky children. Keep preaching on.

DrHenley said:

If you live in a place that does not have adequate natural resources to support the population, I don't have much hope for the better side. Dog eat dog is about all I can see possible. cough...cough...Chicago...cough...cough
.

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Docs got a terrible cough, Detroit to get something done about it

Silent Earth said:

Docs got a terrible cough, Detroit to get something done about it

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Speaking of cockroaches...Silents cousin.

bigpaul said:

I've just been having an online conversation elsewhere, I stated that come SHTF we will see the baser side of human nature( based on my life time experience of other people, people watching etc.etc), this other person wont have it, they think everyone is good and noble and wont commit any crime or hurt others during this time!!!I mean get a grip!!!

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unfortunately the scum will rise up and be known when things go bad,and there is not much you can do about them,in a SHTF situation it will start in the cities and spread out to the country as the scum steal or burn everything they can,,,,it will be dog eat dog at that point,,,in the end they will become roving gangs dealing out pain and death as they steal what they want

My hypothesis
Roving gangs and highwaymen are going to be a problem and major threat but these problems (worst case) are well into a post-shtf once despair consumes the masses, for the meantime most are going to see such events as temporary. For the immediate time following a post-shtf the majority of people are going to remain in their perspective location because it will remain the comfort zone. I believe majority of problems will occur when local, state and federal authority figures are no longer present. Looters like in pre-shtf are going to take advantage immediately following a post-shtf that's a given perhaps some rioting before they realize it would be falling on deaf ears.

In a few countries I've been in it was authority figures that couldn't be trusted, yes one still had bad elements in society but it was the authority that perpetrated the most of the deadly crimes. As a small example here at home, how many LEO's are capable of following the foot steps today of a few in the NOPD during hurricane Katrina? In a post-shtf applied paranoia becomes the rule not trust.

If one looks at the 1977 New York blackout one would get a fairly good picture but amplify that across the nation. Looting, vandalism and fires were the biggest crimes in New York 1977 blackout but murder was down.

Without a crystal ball history and historical events remains our teacher.

Sorry, but I didn't see any religious overtones in either of the initial posts in this thread. Where does all this vitriol come from? From other threads on religion?

I can certainly debate those views on those respective threads, but I really don't see how those come into play here, on this thread at all. And why such hatred for folks who believe differently than you do? Because they preach to others? So be it. They aren't hurting either of us in voicing their opinions.

Just don't understand it. I can disagree with organized religion just fine, while still wanting to have civil discussion with one who feels it is an important part of their life.

Gazrok said:

Sorry, but I didn't see any religious overtones in either of the initial posts in this thread. Where does all this vitriol come from? From other threads on religion?

I can certainly debate those views on those respective threads, but I really don't see how those come into play here, on this thread at all. And why such hatred for folks who believe differently than you do? Because they preach to others? So be it. They aren't hurting either of us in voicing their opinions.

Just don't understand it. I can disagree with organized religion just fine, while still wanting to have civil discussion with one who feels it is an important part of their life.

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to me there is nothing worse than a bible thumper, this is what I call a bible thumper anyone who thinks it is his or her task in life to convert as many non believers as they can,,,,,now I don't believe and have my own reasons for this and I have no intention of going into them,,,but someone start preaching to me and I will shoot as many holes in their beliefs as I can,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,and there are lots of holes,and I will not be polite about it,,,,,,,,,,period


IF I WANTED TO BE PREACHED TO I WOULD BE GOING TO CHURCH...................NOT LISTENING TO SOME NIMROD WHO THINKS HE IS BETTER THAN ME BECAUSE HE BELIEVES AND I DON'T

That is kind of the rub isn't it? The Bible thumpers wonder about the animosity, but really, it stems from this air of superiority most feel, that those not of the faith are "beneath them" and need to be "saved"...when neither is accurate.

Still though, I don't see any mention of religion in the first few posts of the thread, before an attack is launched, and that's where I find it odd. Did some posts get deleted or something? Just don't see where it came from.

Gazrok said:

That is kind of the rub isn't it? The Bible thumpers wonder about the animosity, but really, it stems from this air of superiority most feel, that those not of the faith are "beneath them" and need to be "saved"...when neither is accurate.

Still though, I don't see any mention of religion in the first few posts of the thread, before an attack is launched, and that's where I find it odd. Did some posts get deleted or something? Just don't see where it came from.

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there is some underlying dislike between a few members,and they are all in this thread,,,,,I did not say anything about religion until my previous post #16,,,,so I did not bring it up first,,,,


and this thread only fuels the fire,,,,,,DEPRIVED MY ###,,,,,,,,,,,I now do my best to ignore this idiot as much as I can,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,http://www.doomsdayprepperforums.co...living-without-christ.8657/page-6#post-115319

To hell with TexasFreedom.

OK, I'm confused.

I'm fine with leaving religion in that section of this forum. I didn' mention anything about faith here. Neither did Doc. Doc tossed in some humor about crime & Chicago (nothing religious there). Then in post #15, Gazrok followed by GG started going off about religion.

YOU guys brought the topic into this thread. THEN you are complaining about religion here? Then you reference a discussion IN the religion forum, complaining here?

So please clarify, what in the world are you whining about?